Tag Archives: application

“Paradise Cities are Not the Solution”–1. Feedback Received

I’ll be taking some time to go through the comments posted in this livejournal blog reached by members of the Zeitgeist Movement which I see it as cool to create a point of clarity and understanding without having to ‘oppose’ and fight – that’s the first thing I find cool about all of them which I’ll be replying here as another blog-entry as livejournal does suck at managing comments and having proper information of people when commenting –except for those that left their names and emails for further contact – thanks, accountability starts with speaking in one’s own name.


Okay so here’s the first reply:

(Anonymous) ( wrote:
Feb. 1st, 2011 04:32 pm (local)


Subject: Zeitgeist Movement
“Every problem you have stated in the opinion above is addressed by the
ZM, not as fixed or dogmatic but as an ongoing conversation about those
subjects. The ZM has as its primary goal the education of the population
of the world into a sustainable future, by the realization that existing
systems do not work and in fact cause most of the unsustainable factors,
and science has already discovered means to create a sustainable future.
It’s all about how people think. 
We choose to go with science, because it seems to give the most reliable
working data. After all, Science is the study of Nature, and that is the
direction of human survival.”

Peter Josephs’ approach to the application of the scientific method as ourselves – meaning outside of the regular contrived ways of ‘science’ itself, is cool as a way to get to know ourselves- though the starting point has to be re-evaluated – we suggest Self Honesty as we realize that as you say “It’s all about how people think” and thoughts driven into actions is what has created this entire reality as it is. Human Survival is systematic, meaning there’s more to it than simple human observation – an actual understanding would imply getting to know how this reality has been created, how we’ve been existing as Mind Consciousness Systems within this reality and how we’ve created the current Money System as that Energetic-Enslavement which has defined the entire ‘relationship’ that we have and create with anything/anyone in this world – thus it’s a bit more than just observing, but getting to know the core of how and why we have as human race never actually evolved but just shifted through pictures – without ever actually in essence changing the infamous ‘human nature’ which is the core point we’re looking at and directing-towards in this post.

Such ‘reliable working data’ as science is subject to the observer as the mind that hasn’t actually been able to see itself outside of the mind – thus the relevance of getting to know the facts of this reality to understand how the entire system was deliberately set up to fail to live in a balanced-harmonious way. This is why Re-Education as a deliberate repetition of self-willed actions is an active way of changing such human nature to start developing common sense – as always thinking, speaking, writing and communicating what’s best for all and live by such ways through a Process of Self Honesty – and thus to actually implement it in each one’s lives as actual-actions, deeds, words that are lived that can definitely create a better understanding of this reality as our own creation – hence realizing the focus for now, must be the individual itself –before thinking ‘out of the box’ from that perspective. First things first – focusing on self is the primary point as starting point to be the actual change.

“We consider almost everything else to be irrelevant. There are people of
all religions in the ZM.

Religions imply separation of people – religions have lead to wars – wars are obviously Not best for all as they end up in conflicts of harm and abuse towards fellow man when standing within a self-created identification as part of a group/culture/race above all human basic equality-points. Thus, we don’t support them, we don’t allow them as they are in itself a tampering point to realize Equality and Self Responsibility fully – as the moment you believe in something, you must know you are delegating a part of yourself onto something/someone else –be it greater or not – the single allowance of anything separate from ourselves is indeed separation.

“The first movie Peter made, Zeitgeist: The Movie, was his personal art
project before he met Jacque Fresco and the Zeitgeist Movement started.
The movies after that gives data as to why we have come to the
conclusions we have. But the movies are only a tiny part of the Movement,
with the ongoing conversation being far more important.”


Sticking to simplicity it’s what works best in terms of ‘coming to terms’ with anything – this reality requires simple solutions, simple actions that can be taken by any individual human being that’s simply willing to start caring to bring about a solution to this world. Thus this ‘task’ isn’t taken out of self, but it is instead Embraced AS Self First as we understand how opinions are the building blocks of illusion and opinions create differences that stand in the way of common sense = what’s best for all Life in Equality – that’s the principle all living beings should consider before engaging in any con.versation about changing the world. 

“We are not about cities… that is just showing what is technologically
possible for everyone on the planet, if they choose to live in cities…
if they don’t, that’s fine too, and what we are about is making it
possible for everyone on the planet to have vastly better than their
survival necessities, and do it without even wage slavery, AND do it
without ecological destruction. No livingry is discounted or ignored.
Weaponry, on the other hand is absolutely rejected.”


Technology is a great tool indeed, though it is just that – a tool, a medium to propagate this ideas for now and unite people through the internet. We stick with what’s here – of course much can be ‘projected’ on to the future if one is able to do it, but as I stated in my original post-entry, how is that relevant to this current state of the world, take a look at third world countries – they first require food to have sufficient energy to be able to attend school and not be malnourished and incapable of engaging in any learning activities. Thus the importance of first Equalizing Energy for All as that basic ‘fuel’ to live- which is then Equal Money and the solution we are presenting.

We are both standing for environmental care as ourselves, as an all inclusive system – caring for animals, plants, nature as ourselves and taking on the stand as Life-custodians on earth as how it should’ve always been –

Once again, Money is not the problem –we simply have to change the rules that are guiding the ways money exists and the ways it’s being used.

So, that’s a point to re-consider –again, simply to point it out as what we stand for not in means of creating any opposition at all – just pointing out what’s being missed.

“We are all about the basic causes that are starving a billion people on
this planet. We are all about changing the human behavior that is causing
the ecology, which is our common outer body, to disintegrate. And we are
all about people choosing to self-educate to understand how humanity can
live on this planet with a freedom and prosperity which exceeds all past


Such ‘freedom’ cannot exist as long as the actual mind-patterns that have been transmitted through and as DNA as how the entire human race exists now is what first must be taken on which is the result of the entire acceptance and allowance of ‘who we are’ as the mind. We can’t really be free until All are Free and even there, that freedom is still subject to our basic requirements to actually even consider in making such ‘freedom’ as a possibility in this world. It’s mostly a nice concept that uplifts the human into an ‘Ideal’ – not an actuality which is what very few people are really willing to see and understand = that’s self honesty and thus it is only through knowing our bounds and limitations, through living them, through working with them to transcend them that we can only then get to an actual living solution as ourselves – as individuals changing themselves. So far this has been a very tough point to take on as human nature is systematic in its functioning thus one has to really will oneself to change – caring doesn’t come naturally – and we make sure that we do really stand as what’s best for all without seeking any forms of ‘stepping outside of the box’ without first having taken Self-Responsibility for the entire creation as it is ourselves.

Thus, solutions won’t come that easy – long tough road as hard work is required to do this. By everyone, by each one.

“We are not about Utopia, which cannot exist, or forcing people in any
way, or causing or supporting revolution… we are not about arguing,
either, because we really don’t have to do that. The planetary situation
does our arguing for us. The survival impulse is a paradigm shift that is
global and includes everyone. We are a result of that, and all we have is
a set of ideas and information that is one option for human survival. It
is certainly not the only option although we can see that violence and
revolution will never produce the change we want to see.”


That clarifies the point that I saw through the movie as inciting for a ‘revolution’ as they state which involves dropping money in front of banks and revolting that way.

Yes, what’s best for all is non debatable – we simply all have to agree on basic terms that must be considered to create any actual change in this world and they are based upon all of the above.

Now, here’s the nitty gritty – ideas/knowledge without being placed into action result in simple idealism and inaction and thus just another pipe-dream= useless. And because we realize how this things take time, planning, resources as money, as people getting to understand how important this point is to get to create an actual standing –constant and consistent change, we are taking the first steps and working with ourselves as individuals within the process of learning and understanding how it is that all our actions affect the entire world – understanding how we’ve accepted and allowed this world as it is and thus taking self responsibility for our individual worlds to then be stable and HERE enough to start taking on our environment as ourselves – once again we cannot go trying to ‘fix the world’ without focusing on ourselves first – one must take care of the root of it all before wanting any fruition.

Thus, we have an actual walking step by step process going from the individual into the group, learning how we have to stop such type of mental individualism as ego that separates ourselves, that pushes everyone to think for themselves and their own ‘survival’ instead of being directing ourselves by what’s best for all – within this we direct, live, act, speak, write and share with the world as who we are as human beings observing themselves in self honesty, to expose the delusions that we create as the mind = creating the world as an exact replica of the mind. If we understand this point then it’s obvious we have to start taking on ourselves as our mind first to only then start considering on going any step further.

“And we are not monolithic, or following a dogma or the leadership of
anyone. Jacque Fresco is a 94 year old visionary who we respect and
listen to, but there is no ‘power’ in that since we will not force or
intimidate anyone. Peter is a talented filmmaker with a gift of
explaining complex subjects and a loving heart, and he ‘owns’ the main
zeitgeist site, but he is simply another respected voice in the movement,
he is not ‘leader’ to anyone in the movement who fully understand what we
are about.”


Equality within a group must be represented by an Equal participation of all participants –each one becoming an equal-leader – that’s what we are walking as and definitely learning a lot from each other, to recognizing ourselves in fellow human beings that probably in other times we would’ve feared and judged – so we’re stopping that and simply taking things within common sense so that we can stop our individual-races to become one single race, the human race that finally meets its goal: Equality as Life.

“Going from a few people to 500,000 people all over the planet in about
two years means we are growing fast, and members are at all levels of
understanding. This means that we have a wide diversity of opinions and
ideas which people develop and run with, within our basic understanding
of ‘Do No Harm’. We are trying to bring about a change of mind, and
therefore action, for a world with 6+ billion people and we want to have
that change be as peaceful as the maturing of any human being going from
childhood into adulthood, and since only a good means can create a good
result, it must be peaceful, through voluntary self-education.”


Wanting stays in just that: a ‘want’, a ‘desire’ that doesn’t have any practical living-action plan to take on that want into a reality as a living-process of each one participating and joining the movement. I’d encourage those 500,000 people to start exposing themselves in Self Honesty as to how they exist within the deepest-chambers of their mind and thus having actual real introspection and insight upon how it is that we as individuals are creating this reality as ourselves – thus once again, everything is still remaining at an idealism level with no practical living application – which is what we are here certainly busy with, you can do proper research just in this livejournal blog which I began when getting to Desteni and see how one is actually able to start getting out of one’s own mind bubble into self-direction to care about this reality as a whole. Lots of Self Forgiveness required to make that ‘change’ a reality and most importantly, sticking to that Living Decision of doing what’s Best for All in all ways, always acting in accordance to Life and not ego.


We are actually realistic and we know that 6 billion people – almost 7 now – won’t be walking this process in Self Honesty because it takes an actual understanding to then get ourselves through this process in the most important life-commitment we can ever take within our existence – and this we are walking diligently, each day as ourselves, sharing with the world for all to see – and this, everyone that is able to self-reflect upon one’s world, that is able to communicate and write is suited with the basics to start this process of Self Honesty = actual Living Practical Application of the Principle of Equality as All to then re-educate ourselves not only as having more knowledge and information, but placing it into action as that which is relevant for all equally, practically.


“While many think that is impossible, science seems to show that it is,
and we can do it. We know it is a long term project, which might take
more than one generation, but it must be done right or the result will
not be good.”


Yes, taking the point here is vital – and yes it will take time though once again look at how ‘science’ is taking a major role in that – just plain observation from how it’s been written in your response here.

Best is to simply rely on the basics first as explained above within the ‘basic points’ of understanding ourselves as individuals, as our mind.

“We cannot live with the knowledge that our civilization is starving
billions, slaughtering thousands, and obliterating our ecology when we,
along with all the other people in the world conscious of that, have some
idea of what to do about it.”


We are Certain about what must be done, though it’s not the most ‘flashy’ solution out there as it’s not sugar for the ears of anyone – it is actually quite the opposite as for now the true-nature of the human must be revealed, exposed and thus dissected for everyone to see, to identify ourselves and to get to an actual understanding of our role as creators in this reality. ‘Civilization’ is simply the externalization of our mind in means of creating a septic environment to pretend to be ‘civilized’ monkeys which we know is not actually so and it stays within a single picture being presented as the mask of being ‘more evolved’ and ‘more techno-savvy’ but! The essence of the human being remains the same which is the very first point that needs to be taken on –once again, that in itself will take quite a lengthy amount of time as we have to make sure that this is then created as an educational-foundation for all human beings as without that, any other way of implementing a solution is doomed to fall as the basic foundation of it must be laid upon an overall understanding of us within this world as the units/cells of the entire body that must learn how to co-exist without harming, killing, abusing each other or of the resources as energy that’s being pumped for everyone – though yet not equally distributed – which is causing the cancer in this world. That is what must stop: ourselves from being such cancer in this whole that is ourselves.

Thanks for the reply and expanding upon the points exposed in the entry – it clarifies some – though seems there is still no definitive ways established on how to take that care and consideration into practical-living within a structured way that will lead to a solution that will be consider everyone as to have the same starting point to actually be able to Live and be Supported Equally by the single fact of being a living being in this world.

“You are always welcome to check into us more at
We also have a Teamspeak server so we
can have voice conversations about the ZM and it’s goals and methods.”


Cool, I also suggest you check out the website http://www.equalmoney.org

There’s ONE single goal that must be certain for ALL those that are wanting to create a change in this world: Equality – and that’s not debatable and the ways to get it must have a single easy simple starting point: Self.

Visit http://www.desteni.co.za, visit the forums where we share ourselves as the process and insights we live by when starting to take us individually to create a change within ourselves as part of taking Self Responsibility to then, become life-changing agents, life-coaching people that are able to support themselves and others as Equals. That’s real living practical day to day care.

Check it out – Thanks.


….next replies later –


thanks for reading.

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